With a manageable scoreline and a coach well-known for his cup success, even in hostile situations, even with a less than favorable away goal to live down, Real Madrid must have had some bit of esperanza or hope that for the first time in 5 years they would advance past this stage in the Champions League?

It didn't last long. They were destroyed, humiliated, embarrassed, or run off the park, use whatever cliche you want. Madrid were expecting another chess match like the one they got at the Santiago Bernabeu but got invited to their own smack-down. The reactionary British press might say that it just proves the overall strength of the Premiership over La liga. The Madrid press are in the middle of a downward spiral of "let see who we can blame for this debacle: (Mijatovich, Juande, players, signings, tactics, naivete, but always the refs) and Liverpool are actually coming out of this match with the delusional idea that they're actually quite good.

The truth about what happened is, as usual, somewhere in that mix (except for the part about Liverpool being rubbush, that's all true and then some).

There were many mistakes made. First of all: Torres clipped Pepe on the kneecap just as the Real Madrid defender was clearing the ball which set-up the first goal. It was a foul that wasn't called which led to an easy goal putting Madrid down 2 goals on the road, and yes it was a foul, Torres even looked at the ref afterwards expecting the call that never came.

Secondly, and I don't want to make this all about the refs so I'll hold off on the most egregious call for later, Juande Ramos started a Real Madrid side that are not head-and-shoulders behind Liverpool, but were definitely missing key components to handle the Reds balls-to-the-wall approach: Up front, Raul doesn't have the pace or the physicality to handle the lone striker role, so Juande started Higuain next to him. Gonzalo is a good young player, but he's more of a young Raul, rather than the target man that either injured Ruud Van Nistelrooj or the cup tied Klaus Jan Huntelaar are. Like the corresponding fixture, Liverpool took Robben off his game and his compatriot Snejder, who almost had a wonder-goal from a free-kick, hasn't been the same player since he injured his knee at Ashburton Grove in a pre-season match. Yet, Real Madrid lost the match not because they couldn't score but because they didn't control the center circle. They do not have a monster in the midfield to contend with Mascherano (one Diarra is not as good as another) and Gago likely played his last overly lazy pass for Madrid. They needed a ball-winner and someone alongside who could hit pass the baoll quickly into space. Don't they wish they had Xavi Alonso instead?

Thirdly, well it's obvious isn't it. The penalty that really wasn't. A Liverpool supporter I was with admitted as much, he just couched in the "it's like that phantom penalty they always call at the Stretford End at Old Trafford against us!" Heinze gets called for a handball in the area on a ball that was clearly not. Down by three goals on aggregate before the gents were neatly tucked in their seats, Real Madrid never settled themselves on the road and never recovered like I predicted they would coming into the game.

Despite Casillas's rout saving heroics, Gerrard and the ex-Madrid product Arbeloa extended the scoring later on, so the 5-0 on aggregate scoreline doesn't surprise me, but it also paints a more than unfair picture. Real Madrid are not this bad (I cover them week in and week out) and it flatters a rather pedestrian Reds squad (check their draws against subpar opponents at Anfield) that came out strong at home. Congrats, but the scoreline flatters to deceive.

This week on Forza Futbol Hannah and Mando review the latest from La Liga and Serie A. Get the whole episode here, direct download here or subscribe in iTunes.

Forza Futbol's Mando talks to Andy Brassell. Get the whole episode here, direct download here or subscribe in iTunes.

This week on Forza Futbol Mando and Hannah review the latest from Serie A and La Liga. We discuss the upcoming Champions League match between Olympique de Marseille and Atlético de Madrid and the fan threat around the match, as well as a special rant on Milan's latest match by Hannah.

With the start of the new Champions League campaign, one of the topics that has frequented Spanish commentary and blogs is - Is the Premier League outshining La Liga? Is La Liga are 2nd Tier League? (I don't want to go there, but the same Spanish rags claim that Serie A is a retirement league and will get worse should Ibra or Kaká leave.)

OK, the yahoos from the Spanish rages, exaggerate, freak out and love high drama. They need to fill up their dailies and create news. But it's been awhile since a La Liga team has won the Champions League, Spanish clubs are in debt, and people are worried.

Does the Prem brand better than La Liga? Is the Prem moving towards the NBA mega-sensation and is La Liga far behind? C'mon, La Liga still shows their games at 10pm at nite. This is not conducive to Asia and the the other foreign markets. Do the Spanish teams do a good job of promoting themselves overseas other than the Big Two? Look, Everton has been coming to the US every year and West Ham came over to play this past year. Pompey went to China. These teams are spreading the Prem love and they are NOT the Big Four. Is La Liga doing enough to earn fans and sell shirts? We have the best fútbol, shouldn't that be enough?

Also what about the provincial, club media deals? Is this archaic? Is a league-wide agreement as used in England, more conducive to a strong league?

Deportivo La Coruña's President has said that the future of Spanish football is foreign investment? Do you agree?

Here's my two cents, I think Spain can learn a lot from the Premiership, particularly the media deals and distribution of wealth (even though the richer clubs still get more money due to more appearances on TV and attendances). I also adore the parachute package for teams promoted and relegated. Spain needs something like this drastically. I also think the branding can improve of La Liga, but in moderation. The league as a whole should try and assist in this matter. Why don't they produce and offer Friday preview shows in Spanish? Why aren't some of the Spanish football opinion shows made available, with dubbing or translation to foreign markets?

The infrastructure and organization in Spain needs vast improvement. Why are the games decided sometimes 3 hours before kickoff? How is that conducive to coach potato fans? The technology, camera angles, and TV picture, needs to get to the 21st century. The visuals are appalling. Have you ever compared a Prem or CL game to a La Liga game. The La Liga game pales in comparison.

We need access to more La Liga games on TV or via broadband. Why not offer the other games at a more moderate price? It's difficult for Spaniards to watch non local games, let alone foreigners. This has got to improve. Also access to kits, merchandise, magazines, daily rags would be awesome. Do you know how hard it is to find an Athletic Bilbao kit?

But I like the provincial nuances and local flavor of La Liga and I for one, don't want them to lose this. The play on the pitch is amazing, along with the parity and strength of the mid table teams. The cantera or youth academies keep producing wonderful talent. And there are players that are loyal or don't want to go abroad - see Cazorla, Villa, Silva, Casillas. I don't want foreign investment to come in and ruin La Liga or great an artificial market. We don't need billionaires, just better marketing and business savvy. The Spanish owners already do a fine job sticking their clubs in the red. I also feel that the last remaining socio clubs, need to stay that way - Real Madrid, Barçelona, Athletic Bilbao, etc. It keeps accountability.

But where there is talent on the pitch and in the back office ie managers and technical directors, some will want to go abroad where the money is IE England. But I am not worried about the level of play or the trophies, to me it's all cyclical. The money is in the Prem, but that is a bubble that will burst and a recalibration or reallignment will take place. The Premiership will not always be at the top. Relax.

And honestly I don't want a super league. I don't want to watch just the top leagues or the same teams always winning. That's boring and not what football is all about. We already have the Champions League, World Cup and other tournaments where the cream of the crop rise to the top. Isn't that enough?

OK, those are my thoughts, but I want to hear from you. What do you think? Give us your comments and we'll read them on the podcast. We'd love to hear from you. It's a fascinating topic, that won't go away.